Discussion about this post

User's avatar
Vishakh's avatar

Thanks for the thoughtful read. I think this is a good normative framing of philosophical living which many CBT therapists might agree with as it lays out tools for self-betterment.

The term 'classification error', especially in machine learning, assumes a clean normative target. This may or may not descriptively be true of human beings and human affairs.

Beliefs based in deep emotion may be intrinsic to humanity. For example, often people act as if permanence is possible and it motivates acts of great love, care and ambition.

It's also tempting to frame things like Buddhism as primordial CBT. However, Buddhism even today is practiced mainly as a religion where adherents turn to celestial entities for succor or seek release from a purported cycle of life and death.

The Fundamentalist Plato's avatar

This essay lays out a field of very interesting points and ranges of discussion. I hope it sparks a lot of further discussion because it makes some radical points that are helpful, I think, for everyone to consider. A few questions arose for me while reading. You wrote that not all suffering is pathological or to be eliminated. Are you saying that someone could not rightfully (reasonably) consider the end of any given pain a good thing? Even if pain is at times "informative, morally appropriate or to be eliminated," couldn't it still be that such pain is good to be eliminated, if its elimination then necessarily means the end of some lack of information, the end of some moral punishment, or the end of something that is "to be eliminated?"

You wrote that "underestimating stability leads to a failure to cultivate goods that could flourish" but then wrote that "every composite being will cease to exist -- this is not a contingent fact that might be otherwise." I assume you are aware that very intelligent humans have considered this issue and concluded either that we are not composite beings or that in thinking death is necessarily our annihilation we have "underestimated our stability." But you write as it this is a fact. Do you have proof of this or is this really not a hypothesis? If you admit that there is some uncertainty around what happens after death then you might admit that a lot more fear of death becomes reasonable, for other reasons than you list, since what happens after death could be contingent on actions fulfilled within one's life. Then a fear of dying too early, before one has fulfilled whatever projects that could cultivate a beneficial outcome in and after death, becomes much more appropriate. What if fear of death is a fear of dying before one is ready in this way, before one is ready for whatever may happen upon dying, before one has resolved these nagging confusions about birth and death itself (the who am I really question)?

You mention "goods of sufficient durability to reward investment" as friendship, knowledge, craft, care of loved ones, etc. The question that arose for me is whether these things are always "goods." Isn't an important issue here concerning when and where these types of things are beneficial and harmful? Certainly not all friendship, knowledge, craft, care of loved ones in every circumstance is a good? When are they and when are they not?

You propose that philosophy is the consideration of this boundary between necessity and contingency and I would agree but isn't that dependent on the ability to recognize the boundary between goods and bads? Don't we have to recognize that something is more good than bad in order to then calibrate our fears and desires appropriate to the degree they will last? And I'm not sure I would agree that it is good to lessen our desire for something that is 100% good right now and whose end may or may not be ever actualized (in something other than just a change of clothes or scenery). And I would include good friendships, good knowledge (that is beneficial to all), good skill in a craft (that doesn't ever lead to the creation of useless or even harmful garbage) and good caregiving of loved ones (that isn't more sadistic than anything else).

Thanks for the article. Great points for discussion!

7 more comments...

No posts

Ready for more?